Author, Dr. Joanne Foster shares insights on creativity from her extensive experience as a teacher, parent, and teacher educator at the University of Toronto, teaching Educational Psychology and Gifted Education. She offers strategies from her most recent book, “Ignite Your Ideas: Creativity for Kids” and explores developing teachers’ creativity to impact student creativity.

Listen to the parent podcast with Joanne here. 

Find information on “Ignite Your Ideas: Creativity for Kids” and Dr. Foster’s other books here.

Find “ABCs of Raising Smarter Kids” here.

Find “Being Smart about Gifted Learning” (3rd Edition) here.

At this website, including the bookshop, you can take advantage of  a discount code specially set for the Steve Barkley Ponders Out Loud community! Use POL20! at check out for 20% off these books: “Ignite Your Ideas,” “Being Smart about Gifted Learning,” “ABCS of Raising Smarter Kids, Bust Your BUTS,” and “Not Now, Maybe Later” – valid till Dec. 31st, 2023. Great now and for holiday gift-giving.

Subscribe to the Steve Barkley Ponders Out Loud podcast on iTunes or visit BarkleyPD.com to find new episodes!

Podcast Transcript:

[00:00:01.290] – Steve [Barkley]

Hello and welcome to the teacher edition of Steve Barkley Ponders Out Loud. The complexity of teaching is both challenging and rewarding, and my curiosity is piqued whenever I explore with teachers, the multiple pathways for facilitating student engagement in the exciting world of learning. This podcast looks to serve teachers as they motivate and support their learners. Thanks for listening. I’m delighted that you’re here.

 

[00:00:38.350] – Steve

Building and supporting students’ creativity. Dr. Joanne Foster is rejoining our podcast today with a look at teachers building and supporting student creativity. She earlier recorded a three part podcast series with us, and I’d encourage you to review that to deepen your understanding of the importance of creativity and ways to tap the possibilities. I’ve posted the link to those podcasts in the lead-in to this podcast. In addition, we just recently recorded another podcast for parents, and you’ll find that in the lead-in as well. Dr. Foster has worked in the field of gifted education for over 35 years. She has a master’s degree in special education and adaptive instruction, as well as a doctorate in human development and applied psychology. She taught educational psychology as well as gifted education for twelve years in the Teacher Education Program at the University of Toronto. She is an award winning author of eight books. She writes about intelligence, creativity, child development, motivation, procrastination, and more. Today, Joanne shares her experiences as a parent educator, consultant, and community advocate. Her newest book, “Ignite Your Ideas: Creativity for Kids,” has just been released. Welcome back, Joanne.

 

[00:02:11.690] – Joanne

Thank you so much. It’s a pleasure to be back and to be able to talk with teachers. I taught for many years at the University of Toronto in the Teacher Education program, so it’s wonderful to be able to have this opportunity. Thank you.

 

[00:02:27.200] – Steve

I’m wondering if you’d start us off talking a little bit about your passion around the idea of kids and adults working together to make creativity a part of their daily lives.

 

[00:02:40.230] – Joanne

Absolutely. I’m really passionate about creativity. I find it’s very empowering. It permeates every aspect of our lives. And it’s important to find ways to infuse creativity into everyday activities, whether it’s at home or school or anywhere, actually. It motivates, it enhances connections, it brings a lot of joy. And actually, creativity is at the heart of humankind’s advancements, whether it’s in technology, business ventures, education, the arts, sciences, whatever it happens to be. So I think that’s really why it’s important to work together in terms of helping children become more creative.

 

[00:03:27.270] – Steve

So I work with many schools that have somewhere in their mission or vision statements or their goals that they want students to be college and career ready. And some of them add life ready to that list, and that frequently leads to them having a focus on what they label as “the four C’s” – communication, collaboration, critical thinking, and creativity. I’m wondering if you would share your thoughts on the importance that you see in those four C’s.

 

[00:04:01.390] – Joanne

So communication, collaboration, and critical thinking are all very important and in fact, lead to creativity, which was your fourth C. So as much as I appreciate these three C words, and I think they’re really imperative, I’m going to give you some other ones to think about as well. So let’s just think about what else really matters in a classroom situation and in terms of making the most of children’s educational opportunities. So the first is choice, also an important C word. And creativity is in fact, a choice. Kids who get to choose various aspects of their learning, including the creative endeavors that they want to tackle, will be more invested in the process. There was ancient Greek philosopher who said that choices are the hinges of destiny. And I really think that that’s a beautiful quote. I like that. So choice is another C word. How about challenge? Life is full of challenges, and teachers, of course, are well positioned to help kids learn to problem solve and overcome them and again, use their creativity to do so. Caring is an important C word because a well functioning classroom has students who encourage and cooperate with one another, who are kind and courteous and compassionate, which are C words.

 

[00:05:19.450] – Joanne

Conviction – you have to have determination, enthusiasm, and passion for what it is you’re going to do or what it is you’re going to create. So teachers can certainly help students develop conviction, which can lead to confidence, in fact, another C word. Clarification – I think it’s important that teachers clarify expectations. Ideally, they co set them or co create them with their students so that they can ensure that whatever tasks are on hand are fair and fitting and adaptable, flexible for kids. Change is a C word. Change is a huge C word because it’s inevitable. And teachers can help kids adjust to new programs, new friends, new challenges, new expectations. Congratulations – this is one maybe you didn’t expect, but I think it’s an important one because we have to congratulate children on their efforts, build in that genuine praise, that encouragement, that reinforcement, even those small steps as they work towards and actually achieve their goals. So I should tell you that this is not off the top of my head. I actually have written a book called, “ABCs of Raising Smarter Kids” and the whole thing is done in alliteration, and every chapter is different letter of the alphabet.

 

[00:06:38.520] – Joanne

So if you want to find out more C’s, I’ve got them. You want to find out M’s for motivation, O for opportunities, you name it, it’s there. So “ABCs of Raising Smarter Kids,” I’ll give you the link to that. And for the record, just so you do know, communication, collaboration, critical thinking, and creativity, which was our starting point for this question, all of them are there.

 

[00:07:00.110] – Steve

Alright. So how about you, did congratulations. I frequently have celebration as one of my key ones, so they go together?

 

[00:07:12.990] – Joanne

Yeah. Dance like no one’s watching.

 

[00:07:15.310] – Steve

Yeah. You’ve written about the need to support teachers with professional development around enabling them to be better prepared to support all students and to meet the students needs both social-emotionally, academic, as well as other. What might PD to support and creativity like?

 

[00:07:40.950] – Joanne

Well, I’m going to start by answering this question in terms of thinking about how teachers can challenge themselves to become more effective. And they can do this by acquiring a wide range of tools, skills, resources, support. Sometimes we think of PD as strictly being sort of a group effort on a specific designated day that’s been assigned by the school board or what have you. But really it’s more than that. It is that, but it’s also the fact that teachers have to find various ways on their own too, as well as collaboratively in terms of learning opportunities, finding the conferences they want to attend, networking effectively, and finding other ways to build their skill sets and their confidence. Because ideally, what you want is for creativity to be happening in the classroom as often as it possibly can be. So you asked specifically, what does that PD actually look like in terms of supporting creativity in the classroom? So teachers can be thinking about what it is they currently do, how, when, and where they can connect productively with others, to see what kinds of things they do in their classrooms. Think about what your school or school board needs, what it lacks right now, and that might benefit the creative expression of both students and teachers.

 

[00:09:10.610] – Joanne

And I appreciate that teachers’ lives are really busy, so you don’t want to have to lay on more things for them to consider and do. But other things they might want to think about in terms of enhancing that creativity is to think about time management in their classrooms, the organizational things, the goal setting, the prioritizing, all of that and learn more about things like mindfulness and neuroplasticity, how the brain works and motivation and AI, which is like, wow, that’s a whole other topic, entrepreneurship, so many different things. How to make that optimal match between the student and the program. And in one of my other books, “Being Smart about gifted Learning,” Don and Matthew and I talk about that optimal match and how to make it happen, and different types of program development that can be put into place. I would be remiss if I didn’t talk about differentiation as being important also in terms of enhancing creativity. I mentioned in my previous podcast that I write for the Creativity Post and I’ll provide you with a link to an article on differentiation and creativity that I wrote for the Creativity Post, where I talk about how having a flexible range of options well suited to the individual child can really help them feel comfortable about infusing creativity into what it is they do when they tackle various tasks.

 

[00:10:41.870] – Steve

I don’t know why, but – maybe I do know why – your use of the word caring earlier, I’m hearing it carried over.

 

[00:10:55.890] – Joanne

Yeah, it is, for sure, but let me add one more thing. There’s also self care on the part of teachers, and that’s really important. Teachers who invest in their own creativity, who look after themselves and feel motivated when they walk in the room and happy about what it is they’re going to do, that carries out to the kids. They see that message, it’s conveyed by the teacher that creativity matters, that they’re looking after themselves, and they’re trying to really move forward in positive directions. So teachers might want to think of what kinds of professional development might help them be more creative, so they, in turn, can convey that to their students. So maybe it’s engaging in those collaborative ventures that school board or other places put on, or maybe it’s trying fresh approaches and strategies or applying something really new or potentially challenging. I listened recently to one of your previous podcasts where you talked about the “wow factor.” You described a teacher who brought in this box and told the students that they couldn’t open it until they figured out the volume. And then they got inside the box and there was this whole long thing of candy.

 

[00:12:09.890] – Joanne

Again, they couldn’t help themselves until they were able to divide it properly and share it equally. Anything like that is fun for the kids. It’s creative, it’s wonderful. But by the same token, it requires a lot of preparation on the part of the teacher. So as as an educator, and I myself taught in classrooms for many years, and, as I said, taught in the teacher training program at the University of Toronto. I think you have to be prepared for that effort and agency that I discussed in an earlier podcast, but also know that there are venues, there are ways and avenues to pursue in order to increase your own creativity, feel good about yourself, self care and personal growth, fulfillment.

 

[00:12:55.450] – Steve

You mentioned a little bit about AI, and I just recently read a short piece where a person did a rather creative thing as part of learning, and she was quick to add that the AI resource made it doable. So it gave her the opportunity, it was her idea, it was the teacher’s creativity, but the work of implementing it, she didn’t see that she would have had the time to do that. But the ability to go to AI and tap that AI resource allowed her to give something that she was excited about being able to give to the kids.

 

[00:13:36.380] – Joanne

Right, exactly. And I think this is a whole new frontier. And as we learn more about AI and how it will impact our children’s learning and ways of teaching, whether it’s instruction or whether it’s programming or whether it’s something else altogether, we’re on a learning curve, all of us. So we have to be smart about what we do.

 

[00:14:01.070] – Steve

So there may be a future book on AI and creativity? [laugh]

 

[00:14:04.506]

Maybe in the future. [laugh]

 

[00:14:04.650] – Steve

Your new book, “Ignite Your Ideas: Creativity for Kids,” contains specific strategies that students can employ to build their creativity, as well as strategies that teachers and others who support students can use. Can you share some of the examples of students using those activities for their creativity?

 

[00:14:33.850] – Joanne

Okay, so in terms of what students themselves can do, I think that the first thing is to appreciate that creativity matters in their lives, that they can use that creativity to bolster their thought processes, their outcomes, their journeys of learning. They have to think in terms of how I can self motivate. What is it that really gets me interested and alive and gets my creative juices flowing? What makes me feel good when I achieve something, even if, as I mentioned before, small steps that, as you say, we need to celebrate as well as congratulate. We have to help children understand that they have to build from what knowledge they already have to use that as a foundation or as a stepping stone to build new skills, new ideas, and to involve themselves in connecting with other people, staying engaged in what it is they’re trying to do, asking for help and support if they need it, and to take a look at some of the ideas, in fact, and ignite your ideas. I’ve got hundreds of strategies that will help students become more excited around infusing creativity. So those would be some of the pointers.

 

[00:15:51.530] – Steve

Great. I’m wondering what role a teacher’s creativity plays in the teacher’s instructional and interpersonal success with students.

 

[00:16:04.790] – Joanne

Okay, so I think creative educators have to be willing to push past or sharpen the boundaries of what they already know in the same way that we want students to do that, to take what they know and extend it, and to use that as jumping off points to increase the amount of creativity that will enliven their classrooms. So it might have to do with math, it might have to do with languages or history or science or athletics, whatever it is that they happen to teach, but to use their existing knowledge as a springboard and to encourage discovery, to encourage adventures, to encourage children to use their imaginations to ask lots and lots of questions. I think there needs to be a lot of flexibility in a classroom so that children can negotiate ideas, compromise, use rhyme when they want, use crazy ideas when it hits them as something that’s going to revitalize the project, share what it is that they are working on. And another really important thing here is that teachers have to provide an environment that’s caring. We mentioned caring before, but it’s not just caring. It’s also a warm and welcoming, calming kind of presence that you want teachers to be able to provide for students so that they have that sense that there aren’t closed doors there they can open all kinds of portals to their imagination or anywhere else and engage in creative expression.

 

[00:17:46.550] – Steve

I’m hearing a link learning and creativity. Learning is likely to spark creativity. So a teacher who’s busy learning, engaged in learning, is likely to tap his or her own creativity more?

 

[00:18:07.790] – Joanne

I think so, because as you get into the deep trenches of teaching, you understand that there are so many things you need to juggle. No two kids are alike. No two kids learn alike. And the job is very taxing. I’ve been there. I know. And if you don’t sort of use your spontaneity, use your imagination, think on the fly, find different ways to approach things that maybe are outside the norm, then you miss opportunities to connect with kids. So, yes, creativity is a huge part of learning and teaching, but your question was interesting because you said, does creativity lead to learning or does learning creativity? That was your original point. And that’s a really interesting question, one that would be very debatable for many hours if we had it. But basically, I think it’s a two way street. I think in a lot of ways, our creativity sparks our learning. It points us into new directions, down new pathways, gives us ideas. So creativity does lead to learning, but when we learn new things, that provides us with a basis for trying something more creative and different, provided those who surround us are out there cheerleading for us and saying, “yeah, try something different. Do something. Don’t block your own creativity. Give it a go.”

 

[00:19:34.170] – Steve

I’ve explored at times that same kind of chicken egg example of, do questions cause learning or does learning cause questions? And it’s that same flip flop back and forth between those things as as I learn more, it generates questions, and then those questions drive my next learning and I can see the same link with questions to creativity.

 

[00:20:02.290] – Joanne

Right, so you like to say, “what I’m hearing is…” and then recount, which I think is a wonderful way to crystallize what someone is saying during your podcast. So what I hear you saying, I’m doing the same thing, two way street – I’m hearing you say that it’s important to have knowledge and inquiry and reflection, all as underlying both creativity and learning. Right?

 

[00:20:37.700] – Steve

Right. We’re on the same page.

 

[00:20:44.610] – Steve

So before we close out, I’m wondering if you’d share a couple of takeaways from the book for strategies for teachers to implement supporting student creativity.

 

[00:20:57.390] – Joanne

So the first one, I think, is that teachers, adults of any sort, whether they’re mentors, coaches, parents, teachers, whomever, need to respect and honor children’s aspirations, their curiosities, their strengths, their interests, and their individuality. So respect and honor the uniqueness of the individual. The second one is to be available to offer guidance and constructive reinforcement as children take steps to be creative. That doesn’t mean hover and scrutinize, but it does mean to be available when they require help or need that extra little bit of incentive. I used the word choice before. So my third point here would be to encourage children to make the choice to be creative. They don’t have to be creative. They have to want to be creative for more fulfillment and to increase the breadth and depth of their learning. And the fourth is to help children value creativity, to model it, to show how it can enhance the flow of ideas and pleasure, whether you’re the teacher, whether you’re the student, creativity has the potential to enrich, to inform, to inspire, and that’s really important. So my four takeaways are respect and honor children’s uniqueness, be available., ncourage them to make the choice to be creative and to help children value creativity by making sure it’s infused into what happens.

 

[00:22:34.370] – Steve

Thank you. Joanne, I’m wondering if you’d let people know what’s the best way they can follow up to find you’ve done a ton of writing and work that provides countless resources for folks. What’s the best way people can connect with those things?

 

[00:22:52.590] – Joanne

So you’re welcome to visit my website, which is joannefoster.ca I have a resources page that’s probably way too robust because you’re going to have to scroll to find all kinds of good stuff down there. I’ve got several books that you’re welcome to investigate as well. There’s a discount for this Ponders Out Loud community, which is POL20!, which is in effect from now through until December 31 for 2023 for anybody who’s interested in purchasing a book from the bookshop at the publishers, which is giftedunlimitedllc.com, and the books are available on amazon, Barnes and Noble, wherever you happen to hook into. But I think what’s really important is to get out there and check out some of the resources that are available on my website and elsewhere, and anybody who has any questions or they can certainly connect with me.

 

[00:23:55.470] – Steve

We’ll be sure to add that information on the podcast lead-in to ake it as easy as possible for folks to find you. Thank you so much. Really appreciate it.

 

[00:24:05.780] – Joanne

Thank you. Bye.

 

[00:24:09.710] – Steve [Outro]

Thanks for listening, folks. I’d love to hear what you’re pondering. You can find me on Twitter or LinkedIn @stevebarkley or send me your questions and find my videos and blogs at barkleypd.com.

 

Dr. Joanne Foster is returning to our podcast upon the release of her new book, “Ignite Your Ideas: Creativity for Kids,” written for children 12 and older. It provides understandings and strategies, generates exciting, accessible choices and joyful creative experiences for kids and their families. Teachers will also find countless possibilities and strategies. In this podcast, Dr. Foster highlights the role of agency and effort in creativity. She shares a few of the over 100 sure-fire ways to spark creativity across many different areas of interest that are found in her book.

Find information on “Ignite Your Ideas: Creativity for Kids” and Dr. Foster’s other books here.

Find “Mess for Success“ here. You’re invited to scroll through and explore LOTS of resources, and this particular one is listed partway down under the heading “Articles on Important Topics

At this website, including the bookshop, you can take advantage of  a discount code specially set for the Steve Barkley Ponders Out Loud community! Use POL20! at check out for 20% off these books: “Ignite Your Ideas,” “Being Smart about Gifted Learning,” “ABCS of Raising Smarter Kids, Bust Your BUTS,” and “Not Now, Maybe Later“ – valid till Dec. 31st, 2023. Great now and for holiday gift-giving.

Podcast Transcript:

[00:00:01.130] – Steve [Intro]

Hello and welcome to the Parents as Learning Coaches edition of the Steve Barkley Ponders Out Loud podcast. Parents and caregivers play many different roles and even sometimes conflicting roles as they support children’s development. The pandemic has shown a light on the importance of parents supporting learners. In this podcast, I’ll share my experiences as a teacher educator, parent, grandparent, and continuous learner that can support your coaching efforts.

 

[00:00:38.670] – Steve

Ignite Your Ideas. Dr. Joanne Foster is returning to our podcast upon the release of her new book, “Ignite Your Ideas: Creativity For Kids.” She recorded an earlier three part podcast with us that I’d encourage you to review to deepen your understanding of the importance of creativity and the ways to tap the possibilities. I’ve linked those podcasts in the lead-in to this podcast. Her book, “Ignite Your Ideas” was written for children twelve and older. It enlightens and motivates. It provides understandings and strategies, generates exciting, accessible choices, and joyful, creative experiences for kids and their families. Teachers will also find countless possibilities, resources, and strategies. Dr. Foster has written eight books. She has worked in the field of gifted education for over 35 years. She has a master’s degree in special education and adaptive instruction, as well as a doctorate in human development and applied psychology. She writes about intelligence, creativity, child development, motivation, procrastination, and more. Joanne shares her experiences as a parent, educator, consultant, and community advocate. Today, we’ll be talking about igniting creativity. Welcome, Joanne.

 

[00:02:09.490] – Joanne

Hi. So lovely to be back here. Thank you so much.

 

[00:02:12.830] – Steve

Thank you for coming back. I’m wondering, for starters, if you’d just review some of the key points that we addressed in that three part series that we did for parents.

 

[00:02:23.910] – Joanne

Sure. So, in the first podcast episode, I discussed the power of creativity and offer some action steps for enhancing it. In the second episode, I chat about different questions that kids can ask to become more creative, I discuss why people sometimes struggle with creativity and what to do about that and I discuss different outlets for creative expression. And in the third episode, I chatted with you about purposeful action, and practical strategies for cultivating creativity and I also review some of the key takeaways from the previous three episodes. So I invite people to listen to all three, and please get in touch with me as well and let me know your thoughts.

 

[00:03:11.950] – Steve

The purposeful action piece is a part that I’ve carried forward and have sent people back to in both a couple of podcasts and blogs that I’ve done.

 

[00:03:25.570] – Joanne

I’ve actually cited you in the book because that was your expression, which I picked up on on that particular podcast episode. I loved it. And so, yeah, you’re in there.

 

[00:03:36.550] – Steve

So how does ignite your Ideas extend the extensive writing that you’ve previously done around creativity?

 

[00:03:44.810] – Joanne

Okay, so this is a book for kids and for their families. It’s not a craft book. It’s not a how to guide. It’s a one of a kind burst of glimmers and gleams and flashes of creativity that kids can actually read themselves. I discuss how creativity develops, why it matters, what agency and effort have to do with this, so maybe that’s something we’ll discuss later today, and of course, how kids can ignite the imagination. I have lots of resources, and the last chapter is actually 100 surefire ideas to ignite creativity.

 

[00:04:20.950] – Steve

There’s a phrase that I know you’ve talked about of brain building as an extension from what people usually talk about as brainstorming. Give us a little more detail around those.

 

[00:04:37.230] – Joanne

Absolutely. So brainstorming is actually about collaboration and sharing ideas and then developing them. And it can be wonderfully productive. A lot of businesses use brainstorming, school situations, you name it, it’s out there. It’s people getting together, building relationships, and developing new perspectives. And it’s fun too. So that’s brainstorming. Brain building is actually about boosting brain power. So it’s about reinforcing that neuroplasticity – the way the brain functions, developmental pathways inside the brain. And teachers and parents actually would do well to teach children about how their brains function, what kinds of activities are involved in brain boosting. So you might include things like developing new skill sets, preparing for different outcomes in certain situations, of course, exploring and investigating ideas, using your curiosity, and then using your creativity as well. And I think in a lot of schools now, teachers are actually taking the time to discuss how the brain works with children. And once they grasp that, they have such respect for it and it’s wonderful to see things materialize from there.

 

[00:05:55.350] – Steve

So just a double check for me – I can grow my creativity.

 

[00:06:01.190] – Joanne

Absolutely. Creativity is something that everybody has the potential to increase. Creativity is a choice. You can either choose to use your creativity or not. It has to do with flexible attitudes towards your daily activities, towards your life decisions. And you can actually boost your creativity by supporting your day to day thoughts and actions, paying close attention to what’s around you, using your senses, discovering the wonder that’s out there, all the possibilities that are out there, culturally – wherever you happen to be, there’s always a possibility to use your imagination and let your mind just go.

 

[00:06:53.350] – Steve

There’s a chapter in the book that takes a look at agency and effort, and those are words that certainly educators talk a lot about. And I know effort is big on parents’ list. So where do you want to jump in sharing some thoughts and understanding of those two terms?

 

[00:07:18.910] – Joanne

So why don’t we start with differentiating what the two terms are and what they refer to and then I’ll start with one and then move on to the other and you can jump in in between or at any point in time if you have any thoughts. So in short, agency refers to action and involvement. So a good way to sort of think about that is to consider the quote that Benjamin Franklin once said and it happens to be one of my favorites – “tell me and I forget, teach me and I remember, involve me and I learn.” So that involvement piece is where the agency comes in. Effort on the other hand, is actually hard work. Agency and effort are interconnected and creativity itself comes from taking responsibility for and investing in both agency and effort. So if you want, I can give you some pointers around how to cultivate or support children’s agency and then also a couple of pointers around how to support their effort.

 

[00:08:26.750] – Steve

Okay, yeah that sounds good, but I want to check with the piece – it’s bringing the two of them together then that has the impact on creativity.

 

[00:08:35.440] – Joanne

Yeah, I think in a lot of ways there are other things also that have an impact on creativity. But for now, let’s look at these two because they’re very impactful. So let’s start with the agency. So the first thing around agency in terms of involvement and participation is to help kids to become more proactive, to take ownership of possibilities and participation, to think, what do I want to accomplish? How can I do that? What do I have to do first? What technology might be useful? Who can support me in what it is that I’m doing? A teacher, a grandparent parent, a coach, a mentor? I think if kids are going to be proactive, they also have to have faith in themselves. They have to self advocate if they need particular materials or resources or whatever it is. Sometimes we just have to look around and determine what it is that we can actually do to have a more creative outlook around things and to think about our options and our hopes and our dreams and to follow our strengths. So the first aspect there of agency then is to be proactive.

 

[00:09:43.570] – Steve

So as a parent, what’s a parent action that generates agency with my children?

 

[00:09:56.930] – Joanne

Support their curiosity, their questions, offer genuine praise when they accomplish something, even if it’s a small step. Give them the opportunity to take advantage of the wide world out there, the learning opportunities that might be at their disposal.

 

[00:10:18.810] – Steve

Am I hearing building confidence? Even confidence that comes with mistakes?

 

[00:10:24.340] – Joanne

Yes. Or things that didn’t work – that’s resilience too.

 

[00:10:29.290] – Steve

Okay, so effort.

 

[00:10:31.460] – Joanne

Effort. So the first one was to help kids to become more proactive and involved. The second piece is to help them find life balance. So this one is really important because kids are so busy and they’ve got so much going on in their demands and their responsibilities in school, so helping them to regulate their activities, to manage the things that they have to do to find the right kind of pacing, to help them find a sense of calm during the day, to exercise, to read, to eat properly, to make sure they get enough rest. All of these things will help them to cultivate their creativity, but also their agency, their wanting to be involved in things because they feel good about themselves. So life balance is the second point. And the third is help kids to appreciate their past experiences. A good word for that is retrospection. So to realize that there’s value in looking back on the meaningful things that they’ve done in the past, the things that they’ve enjoyed, that have given them happiness, that make them proud. And to think specifically on their agency, to think about their involvement in those experiences and what it is that they can bring forward and perhaps tap into again, to think about what made me feel good?

 

[00:11:51.220] – Joanne

What did I need to get organized in order to do that? And maybe I can apply it again. So the third point is to think back on your experiences. But I should mention too, it’s also important to think forward. So forethought is also important in there because although you want them to look back, you also want them to plan and be prepared for what’s to come. So it’s kind of a two sided coin.

 

[00:12:13.630] – Steve

Am I hearing knowing myself?

 

[00:12:16.270] – Joanne

You’re hearing knowing yourself, but you’re also hearing knowing where my strengths lie. Again, I said that a couple of times already. And it’s really important because that goes back to that confidence piece. If you feel that you’ve done something that you can build upon, then that becomes a good basis for creativity because you take your past knowledge and that becomes a springboard for what’s to come.

 

[00:12:46.870] – Steve

Okay, so should we go into effort?

 

[00:12:51.370] – Joanne

Sure. So the first part of effort that I think we have to appreciate is that it’s a learning curve. Effort takes time, it takes work. And parents can help kids appreciate that effort will help them understand what it is they can do well, what it is that they might have to work harder on, and what kinds of help they might need to rise above any difficulties that they might encounter. So we’re back to that concept of resilience that we just mentioned. So figuring those things out can take time, patience. But marshaling effort is a huge part of getting to whatever endpoint you might want to get to. And also it’s the journey, it’s a curve. It’s a learning curve. It takes time. And it’s something that can be very meaningful. Sometimes we worry about, in creativity terms, we worry about getting to that endpoint, that wonderful story or poem or picture or whatever it might be that you’re working towards. But if children enjoy the journey, the effort part, and they understand that it’s not hard done by, it’s something that can be very fruitful and gratifying, then that’s important. So the first point there is learning curve.

 

[00:14:14.370] – Steve

It’s interesting because I wrote a book a few years back called, “Tapping Student Effort: Increasing Student Achievement” and patience was one of the words that I had identified that were a critical element of effort because that realization that the first effort that I put in may not have that immediate reward and so learning patience as part of that effort process was important.

 

[00:14:50.420] – Joanne

Indeed. Effort, time, and also opportunities to focus and then refocus and tweak things. Like when I write a book, it doesn’t just pop out of the computer. It’s something that I have to do again and again. And I review and I go back to it and I change words and I check my resources and I check my quotes. It’s a lot of work and I think anything worth doing is worth doing well. And that requires, as you say, effort, patience, time, support. So there are lots of factors in there. So my first effort point then is that it’s a learning curve and we don’t have to do it alone because we all have lots of people we can connect with to help us with our learning. The second point around effort that I would emphasize is that it can lead to really great things, as you mentioned, confidence, creative expression, intellectual development. And we can help kids learn to self congratulate as they take little steps and they get to wherever they want to be or they follow some interest or some sort of pursuit that maybe they’ve never tried before. It’s important for adults to demonstrate this as well, to show that there’s a lot of self fulfillment involved in their own creative expression and from building upon their skills and expanding their range of knowledge.

 

[00:16:10.100] – Joanne

So effort leads to great things. That’s the second one. And the third point around effort is that it provides a means to strengthen relationships. It’s an opportunity to invite others into your world, your activities, whatever it is that you’re doing, to invite them in for guidance, for feedback, for enjoyment, for collaborative purposes, to do things together. So that building of relationships through effort, whether it’s community members, neighbors, friends, family, having others on site to help foster your creative endeavors is a wonderful thing. So the three points for effort is, it’s a learning curve, it leads to great things and it’s a means to strengthen relationships.

 

[00:16:58.550] – Steve

That relationship piece, the word that was going through my head as I was listening to you was support. So it’s the student, the child, the learner understanding that support is available for my creative efforts. Have I got that?

 

[00:17:16.800] – Joanne

Yes, absolutely. And that support can come in different ways. It can come through resource provision. It can be a warm smile or a hug. It could be encouragement, a kind word, a thumbs up, whatever it might take to motivate the child to continue whatever it is that they’re doing and just getting in there and being messy together or coming up with a brand new idea for something. It can be wonderful.

 

[00:17:49.850] – Steve

I’m just smiling at myself as I’m listening to you because a movie is flashing back in my head. The last visit I had to my grandkids, my twelve year old grandson, who’s into the arts, sat me down at a table where he was working on a beaded project that he laid all these beads down and then had to melt them when you were all finished to create a final product. And he required that I needed to do one while he was doing his. And my big fingers really struggled with dropping all those tiny beads in. But I know the strong relationship piece that came out of it.

 

[00:18:42.490] – Joanne

But it’s even more than that. I think it’s wonderful that you did that because you were showing him that you were persevering, that you were doing something intricate and finicky and unusual and the fact that you were mustering that ability and that you were putting forth agency and effort to come up with whatever it was you were doing. You were sending a really important message. So, yeah, good for you.

 

[00:19:04.420] – Steve

Mine was much smaller than his, but I did finish one.

 

[00:19:06.400] – Joanne

It’s an opportunity to talk and laugh. What could be better?

 

[00:19:11.810] – Steve

Yeah, that’s what I was going to say through the whole thing.

 

[00:19:16.200] – Steve

I think he read support just by being there and engaging in it with him was read as a form of support.

 

[00:19:25.030] – Joanne

Exactly. And again, sometimes you have to know when to step back and let them have that independence and do it on their own. And other times you have to sort of hop in and join the fun and say, “can I join you?” And if they say no, you respect it, and if they say yes, then get right in there and do your reading, or whatever it is.

 

[00:19:41.790] – Steve

This was one that was side by side. He did his own thing, which was substantially bigger and more complicated than mine, but he enjoyed watching me struggle with my little one.

 

[00:19:53.440] – Joanne

That’s okay. But you had fun and you laughed, right?

 

[00:19:57.620] – Steve

Yeah, absolutely. Well, your book is filled of ideas for igniting creativity. So let’s take some of the thoughts that you’ve had for kids for kids to use directly from the book for themselves.

 

[00:20:17.350] – Joanne

Okay, so as I say, there are ideas all throughout the book, but the last chapter has got 100 different specific ideas, so I’ll share just a few of those. But I just want to point out that the ideas really span a broad range of possibilities. There’s technology, science, arts, writing, entrepreneurial pursuits, leadership ideas, community involvement, things to do in the kitchen, things to do with nature, problem solving, virtual travel. There’s a ton of different possibilities out there, so I’m just going to give you just a couple or whatever and their jumping off points. So the very first one of the 100 is actually to read, because reading can open so many doorways for children. Past, present, future, science fiction, historical fiction, poetry, legends. There’s so many themes and options and ideas just waiting to be grasped and then extended. So reading broadens understanding of the creative process, understandings of what’s ordinary, what’s extraordinary language skills, it’s just powerful. So the first way to enhance creativity that I suggest is through reading. The second point I just want to make here is an idea of interviewing people. Kids of any age can interview people and find out what it is that have made a creative impetus for them and also what’s made the world a better place.

 

[00:21:56.230] – Joanne

So perhaps they want to interview a conservationist, or perhaps they want to interview someone who runs a charitable foundation or maybe a clown and how they make children happy, whatever it might be, department store, Santa Claus. Whatever it might be – juggler, whoever. Just that concept of asking questions, getting answers, taking those ideas and extending them forward. And questions they can ask are things like, well, what makes you happy? What makes you feel creative? Is there anything I can do to help you in doing these wonderful things that you do? So a second possibility, then, is interviewing people. A third possibility for creativity – this is actually number 32 in the book in the last chapter, is to surprise someone. To do something nice but totally unexpected, for somebody not to be too fussed about your artistry or your technique or whether you can get those beads exactly right in whatever it is you’re producing.  That doesn’t matter. The idea is to just focus on the interaction, on being kind, and getting a sense of how creativity and thoughtfulness can strengthen relationships, which goes back to that other point I said earlier about effort.

 

[00:23:18.810] – Joanne

And I’ll give you another one here, too. This is the fourth one on ways to become more creative. And this is actually number 51 in the book. And it’s to investigate other cultures, to tap into what’s going on elsewhere, because creative ideas happen all around the world, and sometimes there are wonderful things going on that we might not otherwise know about. So that, in turn, can enhance your efforts in agency when you see some wonderful things happening elsewhere. So, for example, Japan is known for haiku poetry and for beautiful gardens, tea gardens and hill gardens and dry gardens. And then you’ve got the Inuit culture, which has beautiful paintings and clothing and carvings. And Amish culture has wonderful quilts and stitching and beautiful patterns. So the idea here is to find those cultural influences from all around the world and allow them to breathe new life into the creative projects that you might want to try. So those are four ideas.

 

[00:24:24.060] – Steve

As I hear the four, it seems that they would all apply directly to me for myself.

 

[00:24:30.310] – Joanne

Great. There you go. So I’m going to review them for you. The first was to read. The second was to interview, which is what you’re doing right now. The third is to surprise someone so I’ll watch my inbox to see what you do. And the third to investigate other cultures, which isn’t so far off because you’re sitting in Switzerland and I’m sitting in Canada.

 

[00:24:50.990] – Steve

Yeah and I just know that all of those have that growth impact for all of us. It’s powerful. I’m wondering if there’s a piece that you want to point to as an example for what parents and other people who support kids development might from the book for themselves.

 

[00:25:15.620] – Joanne

Okay, so I’ll give you four ones. I gave you four quick kids, I’m going to give you four quick ones for adults. So the first one is think about what you regret not trying yet. In other words, what would you really like to do but you haven’t yet done? Sometimes we call this a bucket list, but you might want to go bungee jumping, or maybe you want to swim with dolphins, or maybe you want to rescue stray cats or dogs on a safari or learn a new language or walk across the glacier. Who knows, right? Everybody has their own sense of what it is they want to do. Why not propel yourself forward and show kids that you’ve got some gumption and that you want to try something? Now, certain things you can’t do, like you may need specific lessons like if you want to pilot a helicopter or you want to become a firefighter and deal with these horrible fires that are happening, or if you want to win a marathon, for example. I mean, that takes skill and training and whatnot. But even then, if that’s your goal, then take those first few steps, whatever it is you have to do.

 

[00:26:20.510] – Joanne

If you show kids that you are resourceful and creative and you’ve set a goal and you’re working towards it, then you’re sending a really powerful message.

 

[00:26:33.100] – Steve

Big modeling role for us to play as adults.

 

[00:26:34.850] – Joanne

Exactly. So that would be my first supportive idea, is to show your own desire towards being creative and and valuing it as part of your life and stepping out on that limb a little bit and trying things. The second piece is to be a buddy, to be a cheerleader, to work alongside kids just as you were doing with your grandson, but also becoming involved in the planning process, the brainstorming process, as well as the fun. So whether it’s making beads or making slime or co-creating a story and turning it into a puppet play, whatever it might be, just welcome the pieces and help kids put them together by being a buddy, being a friend as well as whatever professional or familial role you have. That connectivity and doing the activities together at a pace that’s comfortable for them because sometimes adults want to sort of take the lead and do it – I can do it faster, I can do it better. But in your case, not necessarily so, but whatever that togetherness piece and the embracing of messiness, that would be another point I would like to point out, too, because I think that we sometimes miss the opportunities to do the stuff that might involve the cleanup after.

 

[00:27:53.180] – Joanne

So it’s okay if they make furniture forts, or they doodle or they splash or they jump in mud puddles, or they drop beads on the floor, or they spill the slime in some way that’s maybe not wonderful, but that’s okay. Just do it. It’s part of the happiness and part of the creative fulfillment. Actually, just so you know, I wrote an article on that, it’s called, “Mess For Success” and I wrote it in the Creativity Post, and I should tell your listeners to have a look at the Creativity Post. I’ve got an entire column there with about 100 different articles. This one on mess for success was back in October of 2022. And I’ll give you the link to put in the lead-in as well, if you would like.

 

[00:28:32.040] – Steve

I’d love it.

 

[00:28:33.300] – Joanne

It helps kids find different ways to dance wildly and step outside their comfort zone and to get in touch with their creative side. So the first was to be a buddy little second embrace. Messiness was the first and the first was a bucket list to embrace what it is you haven’t tried. So those are the first three. And the fourth one would be to challenge yourself, to try something that maybe you’ve never tried before, but to be willing to go beyond, to persevere, to understand the power of resilience. To know that you can take breaks when you need to, but to really stretch in ways that maybe you haven’t.

 

[00:29:26.230] – Steve

Well, Joanne, thank you so much for everything you’ve shared here. And I wanted to check, is your website, joannefoster.ca? Is that the best way for listeners to connect with you and to find out more about ignite your ideas?

 

[00:29:43.470] – Joanne

Absolutely. joannefoster.ca. I have a very robust resources page. I have separate pages on each of my books so that people can find out more about those. And my publisher, which is Gifted Unlimited, is very kind in that they are offering a 20% discount to your listeners if they wish to purchase any of my books. And they can also get them on Amazon if they want, or Barnes and Noble or anywhere. But the discount coupon is good until Christmas time, or till the end of the year, actually. So it’s good for gift giving as well.

 

[00:30:20.710] – Steve

That’s great. So just give I want to be sure people got the clarity. What do they have to do to use the coupon?

 

[00:30:29.620] – Joanne

They just have to go to the website, which is giftedunlimitedllc.com. I’ll send that to you for your lead-in as well. If they go to the bookshop, they just go through the steps as indicated on screen and Amazon and other sites, they know what to do, I’m sure. And I also have another book called Beyond Intelligence from a Canadian publisher which might be of interest to them as well. It’s about nine years old, I think, now, but it still has lots of ideas and a full chapter on creativity too.

 

[00:30:58.300] – Steve

Well, thank you. We’ll be sure to put all that in the lead-in to this podcast.

 

[00:31:03.520] – Joanne

Great.

 

[00:31:04.020] – Steve

Appreciate it.

 

[00:31:05.260] – Joanne

You have a great day. Always nice to chat with you. And I’m going to give you one more tip for you and for everybody else. Find those like minded people. Find those people who have the same kinds of enthusiasm and excitement as you do, Steve, and as I do. And let’s get together and let’s continue to encourage the creative vibe that we’re talking about today.

 

[00:31:31.070] – Steve

Thank you. Take care.

 

[00:31:32.510] – Joanne

Thank you. You too. Bye.

 

[00:31:36.110] – Steve [Outro]

Thanks for listening, folks. I’d love to hear what you’re pondering. You can find me on Twitter or LinkedIn @stevebarkley or send me your questions and find my videos and blogs at barkleypd.com.